Posted by: Lynne ®
07/03/2005, 18:50:51
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Hi Paula,You may want to talk to your otolaryngologist (or a pulmonologist) about this; but, in theory, the larynx performs the following functions in this order of importance: Breathing, Swallowing, Phonating (talking). With any procedure directly into the larynx affecting our phonating (such as Botox or surgery), it's always possible that your breathing or your swallowing could be affected, either temporarily (with Botox) or permanently (surgery). Depends on the individual case. Fortunately, there are alot of SD'ers on this BB who can tell anecdotal stories of their own experiences with aspiration, and the best ways to avoid it. In general though, even folks with normal larynxes -- who don't have SD or Botox to treat it -- periodically have a situation we usually identify as gagging and "ooops, it went down the wrong pipe" (where our food/water goes into the windpipe, rather than the esophagus and we choke to cough it up). With a normal larynx, it usually happens when people are trying to talk and eat/drink at the same time. Can you educate us, as to what was brought to your attention? Was someone worried food/liquids would get into the lungs with the aspiration, and cause problems later if they stayed there? Was it a medical person, or a layperson? I never heard of that situation either, but would be interested. Especially in what a pulmonologist might say about it, since it wouldn't be just SD'ers who have the problem. Interesting question. --Lynne (AD-SD - 15 years; RLN surgery; PVFM - breathing; Northern California)
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Posted by: Paula B. ®
07/04/2005, 01:38:35
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Hi Lynne,My Mom told me that Stroke patients whose vocal cords have been paralyzed have this problem, of water getting into their lungs, and it's very dangerous. I know, from experience, three shots of Botox already, that the gagging reflex is very uncontrollable. Yet, this time it is more easy to control by taking small sips, and even using a straw again. My Mom mentioned knowing someone who suffered from a Stroke who dealt with this. I just wanted to know for sure, if this can be possible in our situation. Thanks for your reply, Paula
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Posted by: Marilee ®
07/03/2005, 19:10:27
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I'm not a professional, as Lynne suggested, but I am an
SDer who also worries about aspiration. But in my case,
after Botox (for just 2 or 3 wks) I can choke a little
on liquids if I swallow too much at a time. So I have
learned to be VERY careful in swallowing SMALL amounts,
and it also helps me to use a straw. (However, others have
said they cannot use a straw.) You just have to eat & drink
slower for a while. And as Lynne said, it is easily
coughed up if it does "go down the wrong way".That is MY experience, at least. I am working on it right
now, since I just got Botox on both vocal cords 2 1/2 weeks
ago. It is not much of a problem at all if you take
tiny swallows. Hope this helps some. Marilee
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Posted by: Paula B. ®
07/04/2005, 01:50:34
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Thanks for your reply Marilee,Unfortunately, since I posted my question, I have noticed only twice, after drinking liquids, that my chest kind of hurts. Not that I'm a hypochondriac, or someone who fears having something they really don't, but it sure would help to be sure. Ever talk to someone who told you they were sick, after talking for over 10 minutes, and all of a sudden you felt you were sick? Kind of a mind thing, if you know what I mean. Thanks again, Paula
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Posted by: Samietooo ®
07/04/2005, 21:18:18
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Hi Paula. Unfortunately I know what you're saying about stroke victims and their swallowing wrong and going to their lungs!! I've gotten botox for many years now and I hardly ever choke anymore when drinking (or eating). When it does happen, it is uncontrollable and an awful feeling, I know! Even just swallowing the wrong way, which can happen to anyone, I definitely noticed with botox it cannot be controlled and it feels to me like I can't catch my breath! Also sneezing and even coughing is strange! I am going to try to remember to ask my doctor about this tomorrow. If I find out, I'll let you know. In the meantime, best of luck with your injection! Carol
(Florida)
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Posted by: Samietooo ®
07/05/2005, 14:41:59
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Hi again. Spoke to my doctor today about your question, Paula. He said that yes, fluid can go to the lungs when we're choking while drinking liquids, BUT, because we are in much better health than a stroke victim, for example, we would have the strength to cough it up and NOT get pneumonia. He said he has never heard of any botox patient getting pneumonia after botox.In any case, we all have to be careful when swallowing, especially fluids, after botox! That is my opinion. Hope that helps. Carol
(Florida)
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Posted by: Paula B. ®
07/05/2005, 18:31:30
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Thank you so much Carol,That is so nice of you to ask your Dr. that question for me. :) I feel much better now, that I don't have to worry about it. One less worry off of my mind sure helps. :) I try to always be careful, but most of the time that one gulp makes me choke.. I guess sometimes it seems so easy while sipping, I forget about it, and just swallow the last drops normally... I did tell my Mom this also, so now she has one less worry too. :) Thanks again, Paula
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Posted by: Samietooo ®
07/06/2005, 07:57:03
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You're very welcome, Paula. That may have been on other people's minds too and was a great/important question!! Take care and again good luck!! Carol
(Florida)
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Posted by: Jeanette ®
07/06/2005, 18:18:49
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It is recommended to take small sips and tuck your chin into your chest and then swallow - that works for me.
Jeanette (New Zealand)
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Posted by: mdubovick ®
07/10/2005, 11:08:06
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There is a swallowing technique that can minimize choking/gagging on liquids just after getting a Botox shot. Lowering your head, i.e. having your chin touch your neck just as you are swallowing, seems to stop the choking/gagging.
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Posted by: Ellie ®
07/10/2005, 13:12:55
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I have not yet been convinced that botox would help me, but after reading all of your experiences with choking and trouble swallowing, I am even more hesitant to try it. The doctor who suggested "it might help" me, never mentioned these frightening situations. Is this the norm, or do some folks get the shots with few side effects?
Quite frankly, if I could just breathe easily without having to concentrate on it, my vocal problems would seem like the least of my worries.
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Posted by: Renee ®
07/10/2005, 17:08:19
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Having trouble swallowing is a normal side effect for the beginning stages of a botox shot. When you are in the whispery, breathy stage you will have trouble swallowing thin liquids. Some ways to deal with this are by holding your breath while swallowing and using a straw. Sometimes there will be some choking involved. This side effect of botox is more than worth it for me for a few days to a couple of weeks to get a couple of months of good voice. But everyone is different. Some people would just rather put up with their spasming voice. I prefer the shots...Renee ADSD/ Austin, TEXAS
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Posted by: Marilee ®
07/10/2005, 17:33:26
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That is certainly up to you, Ellie. We each have to make
our own choices. You just have to decide if getting
relief from your present suffering is worth risking a few
small side effects.In my case, there is no question. Without Botox, I could
not see well, chew my food, hold my head straight, talk
or breathe! The 2 or 3 weeks I have to eat and drink more
carefully are definitely worth it. And as someone else
mentioned, after the 1st time, you get used to it, so you
naturally take smaller swallows and eat slower. That's all
there is to it. There are possible side effects to ANY
medication, which we all have to weigh. If your only problem is voice, you maybe can live with
that. If you have laryngeal dystonia, or paradoxical
vocal fold motion, with throat spasms
that block your breathing, then Botox would help that. Oh yes, if anyone is terribly worried about about liquids
"going down the wrong way", there is a product called
Thick-It you can get at drug stores to thicken any liquid.
Nursing homes use that for their weaker patients. I'm sorry if we have frightened you from getting help
if you need it. But maybe you can get along without it,
if that's your choice. Best wishes to you for whatever you decide!!
Marilee, Indiana (adSD, CD, OMD & Bleph- Meige's 5 yrs.)
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