Speaking of Causes . . .


Posted by Jeff Lovell ® , Apr 03,2001,09:42   Archive
The mercury in fillings thread has drifted into a discussion of possible causes of SD. Obviously that's a subject we probably all have pondered. There are probably a wide range of causes, many of which have been discussed at length.
There is one possibility that has crossed my mind on a few occasions, but which I have never seen discussed. (Ok, now you can all jump down my throat for missing a symposium or two!)
That possibility is the humble PC. Now before you all laugh . . . I have noticed that a high proportion of Dystonians are very computer literate - and not only those who use the PC for forums such as this. Many of us have used computers a lot. In my own case, I have spent days on end sitting in front of monitors since the late 1970s when the screens were still only black and white.
It wasn't until the late 80s that manufacturers became aware of the significant electromagnetic radiation emitted from computer monitors, and standards were introduced to limit the strength of such emissions. Could such exposure over a prolonged period be a possible cause of our strife? I'm not suggesting that it is the only cause, but it could be one factor.
When I read of people being helped by sleeping on or wearing magnets - magnets whose field strength I suspect to be far less than that emitted by early model computer display screens, I cannot help but wonder.
Food for thought?
Jeff in Australia.



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Re: Speaking of Causes . . .

Re : Speaking of Causes . . . --- Jeff Lovell
Posted by Karen campbell ® , Apr 03,2001,09:58 Top of Thread Archive
Hi Jeff,
I just read your e-mail and thought I would respond with my own personal view. I have been living with SD for 8 years and am fairly new to the PC world. Who knows, maybe there is a connection. I have however had extensive dental work and mercury fillings. I'm interested in knowing more about the magnets. Do you know if they have worked for others?
Karen in Canada



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Re: Speaking of Causes . . .

Re : Speaking of Causes . . . --- Jeff Lovell
Posted by Dawn F. Smith ® , Apr 03,2001,14:27 Top of Thread Archive
I just had to say that I'm out of this one. My SD started at least 6 years before I was ever even anywhere near a computer. Prior to being in front of a computer, I spent endless hours in front of a television set but we can't even go there....half the world would have to have SD to prove a connection there. LOL
It did surprise me, though, that when I first found out I was pregnant and was working in front of a computer all day, 6 days a week....the doctor told me to change job duties during my pregnancy and stay away from the computer as it could injure a developing fetus. That really shocked me, I never thought of computers as dangerous. Live and learn.
I do appreciate your post though....I am one of those "inquiring mind" type people who never stop questioning the causes of everything. There have been many posts on various causes ( I hate to use that term) or rather, things that could have triggered the onset of SD, worsened the symptoms etc. etc. and it is always interesting and sometimes amazing to see just how many of us on the bb have in common. I've pretty much set my mind to SD being a neurological/genetic affliction but even still, there have been people who say they that there are no other people in their family tree with other Neurological disorders. Mine is full of them and one other possible case of SD ( an aunt with a "strange" voice). OH WELL...but, sometimes, the searching is a good thing for people like us who are struggling to come to terms with living with any type of disabling affliction.



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Re: Speaking of Causes . . .

Re : Speaking of Causes . . . --- Jeff Lovell
Posted by Lynne Martinez ® , Apr 03,2001,16:20 Top of Thread Archive
Jeff...

C'mon. Let's get real.

--Lynne

PS1: You said it yourself...you've missed the symposiums. Also, in some cases magnets are a benefit. Depends on your case. EMF works for people and animals which require a "jump-start" in their focused circulation (certain area). If the "disturbance" in your body is not circulatory or respondant to an EMF-field, magnets will not work. I always think they are worth a try but they do NOT work for everyone and they do not work in every area of our bodies. It's NOT a panacea.

PS2: As the good docs in Michigan would say (to paraphrase), you can't always make a weird connection like that ~ computers and SD? In my mind, the reason why people with SD and dystonia sit in front of computers and are highly-computer-literate is because they are also HIGHLY intelligent. Dystonia and SD has more to do with your intelligence and neurological-make-up than what equipment you use. It's the cart and the horse or the chicken and the egg. Figure out which came first. It's not the equipment itself. Watch out when you try to make those connections because you might be quite wrong and you might allude and confuse some people who haven't done their research.




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Re: Speaking of Causes . . .

Re : Re: Speaking of Causes . . . --- Lynne Martinez
Posted by Jeff Lovell ® , Apr 03,2001,18:54 Top of Thread Archive
Hi, Lynne -

Thought your post was slightly harsh! I certainly did not mean to imply that PCs are giving people dystonia. I simply wanted to throw the idea into a forum of informed (and intelligent!) people who could add the prolonged use of old unprotected VDUs to the long list of other possible causes, or triggers.

There was quite a stir in the computer industry 15 years ago when health-conscious people realised that sitting very close to a computer VDU for long periods of time (as I did) exposed users to a potentially harmful EMF, the effects of which are still unclear. Today all monitors comply with pretty tight emission standards and pose no threat, but it was not always so. Nobody thought twice about it when I was programming back in the '80s. And when I purchased computer monitors in 1994/5 I found that most vendors were totally unaware of the issue, and the relatively few monitors which did comply with the best EMI standard at that time (called MPR II) cost a couple of hundred dollars extra. So most systems sold here before 1995 were not compliant. Given these facts plus the high percentage whose diagnosis is idiopathic, I don't think my post was too unreasonable.

I should also make it clear that I was not endorsing magnets as a treatment. I mentioned them only to demonstrate that there is a link, suggested by some, between emf and some dystonia. I agree 100% with your PS1.

Regards, Jeff.




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Re: Speaking of Causes . . .

Re : Re: Speaking of Causes . . . --- Jeff Lovell
Posted by Lynne Martinez ® , Apr 03,2001,21:42 Top of Thread Archive
Jeff,

Sorry. Certainly no intention to be harsh. Maybe I've attended too many symposiums and done too much research (IOW...I can be accused of being too much into reality and possibly that has gotten the best of me...I plead quilty).

Please feel free to write me on my private e-mail address. I would do the same for you but I don't see an e-mail address for you on this post. I'll scramble and look for your e-mail address on some of your other posts though. Other than that, I have enjoyed your recent posts...seriously. They show alot of intelligence and humor (and I have read them all) so I have alot of respect for you and the recent contributions you have made to this BB and possibly we just need to get to know each other better in order to understand each other so that we don't mis-interpret each other. That last post was not intended to be harsh in any way. I just figured I was doing conversational-spar with another intelligent SD'er. You are correct that, if we don't know each other very well, posts can be misconstrued so I apologize for sounding harsh.

My e-mail address is above so please write me off the BB.

--Lynne




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Re: Speaking of Causes . . .

Re : Re: Speaking of Causes . . . --- Lynne Martinez
Posted by Jeff Lovell ® , Apr 03,2001,22:35 Top of Thread Archive
No apology needed from you, Lynne. All is forgiven. Actually I wasn't really upset. The trouble is that without a camera it's hard to see the tongue in cheek (sorry Cowtongue - not meant to involve you!). Happy to drop you a line later.

My first post was a bit flippant - wanted some reaction - but I can see from the responses that I should have been more careful, and have tried to clear that up with my second post. I should probably make it clearer still -

I am not referring to the normal PC monitors in widespread use today. My thoughts relate to the small VDUs that were first attached to mainframe computers in the 1970s, and were later used in early PCs in the 80s. At the time, computer people were excited about being able to link directly with a computer, instead of using previous methods like punched cards. In those days nobody was too concerned about occupational health and safety, and I have clear memories of programmers sitting close to their tiny monitors, typing away for hours on end without a break, week in week out, year in year out.
I was such a person. It was after doing this for many years that my cervical dystonia developed. I don't know what happened to other such people. Hence the little niggle in the back of my mind.

So don't throw away your PCs, folks - the sky isn't falling. It's just some guy thinking out loud and not explaining himself clearly. Sorry.

Jeff




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Re: Speaking of Causes . . .

Re : Speaking of Causes . . . --- Jeff Lovell
Posted by Ed H. ® , Apr 03,2001,22:43 Top of Thread Archive
In my case, it was the bad voice that drove me to become more computer-literate, and not the other way around. I use the computer in large part to avoid my nemesis -- the telephone. On the computer, I can keep in touch with family and friends, buy airline tickets, rent a car, reserve a hotel room, and buy just about anything I want or need.

It's important to remember that temporal association does not imply causation. For example, the anti-vaccine crowd is quick to latch onto anecdotes about babies who have had vaccines, and then got autism or died of SIDS. Yes it's true that babies who have been vaccinated do get autism or SIDS. But statistical studies have shown that vaccines do not "cause" autism or SIDS. -- Regards, Ed H.




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Re: Speaking of Causes . . .

Re : Re: Speaking of Causes . . . --- Ed H.
Posted by Lynne Martinez ® , Apr 03,2001,23:02 Top of Thread Archive
Ed,

Exactly...on the "cause and effect" thing. That was what was on my mind when I did such an abysmal job of responding to Jeff earlier in this thread. This point (the "temporal association") was mentioned several times at the Michigan Symposium by very skilled doctors. IOW, as the doctors confirmed, just because something happened at the same time as something else doesn't mean they are related in any form whatsoever. They could be but we have to be very careful on those assumptions. The conversation on that subject in Michigan was quite fascinating to me after so many of these types of threads on the BB.

Since you have already identified yourself as a medical professional, thanks for additional medical information on this subject.

--Lynne




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Re: Speaking of Causes . . .

Re : Re: Speaking of Causes . . . --- Ed H.
Posted by Jeff Lovell ® , Apr 03,2001,23:50 Top of Thread Archive
Ed, I agree with everything you say, including vaccines and temporal associations! I have had mild cerebral palsy since birth and SD for as long as I remember. I developed Cervical Dystonia in the mid 80s, about 10 years after the regular use of dodgy VDUs. I do NOT believe they started my SD. But who knows? Most probable cause for me is either an age-related extension of basal ganglia damage due to oxygen deprivation at birth, or else a reaction to one or more of the huge array of meds I have been prescribed over 57 years. Who knows?
When faced with uncertainty it doesn't hurt to think outside the square. I've long since given up worrying about what started my neck problem, but in the face of uncertainty I think any scrap of an idea is worth tossing around - even if only to rule it out.
All the best. Jeff



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Re: Speaking of Causes . . .

Re : Speaking of Causes . . . --- Jeff Lovell
Posted by don nesbitt ® (Don Nesbitt,don nesbitt), Apr 04,2001,09:00 Top of Thread Archive
After submitting a comment about other causes for my SD, it dawned on me that I could identify another influence. This sounds strange to me, but after all the other stuff that's on the BB, it might make sense. I had my first BOTOX treatment about two months ago. A month ago, my voice was great, then it started cracking, then cleared up again. The cracking started after I ate sunflower seeds. Most of them were not even salted, just roasted. It probably has to do with the dryness, but I can down a couple quarts of water along with them and they still have the same effect.
With all of the other bad habits I've had to give up because of this SD, I'm afraid to think what it will be after sunflower seeds. Probably breathing.




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Re: Speaking of Causes . . .

Re : Re: Speaking of Causes . . . --- don nesbitt
Posted by Steve ® , Apr 06,2001,13:00 Top of Thread Archive
Oh sure and maybe it's also caused by eating pizza. I mean... I had a big old supreme pizza a few weeks ago and that's about the time my voice started getting real bad. It must have been the pizza!! Damn and I really like pizza too!!

Can we please stop this thread?




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computers and breathing

Re : Speaking of Causes . . . --- Jeff Lovell
Posted by Micki ® (micki,Micki), Apr 04,2001,12:19 Top of Thread Archive
There is a study that shows that sitting in front of a computer alters your breathing and makes is shallower. This has something to do with the brain syncing with the computer monitor. If I find the original reference, I will post it.



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Re: computers and breathing

Re : computers and breathing --- Micki
Posted by Steph ® , Apr 04,2001,14:55 Top of Thread Archive
I don't think the computer is taking over the brain AHHH!! At least I hope not, because we'd have a bunch of robotic people wandering around. TThe brain works faster than a computer, probably the hindbrain as well, and I have never heard of that. It could cause shallow breathing because of slouching at a computer (that reminded me now to straighten up!)
Steph



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